Video and photography at tango events
As some of you may know, I am a passionate photographer and in the last few months I covered a few festivals and milongas (you can see the results on my website under EVENTS). I have a 9-5 job, as a computer programmer but I'm getting to a point where I'd like to stop doing that. As such, I put some thought into becoming a full time photographer. Part of that research was to see if one can combine tango with photography and try to make some money (not necessarily make a living just by covering tango events).
So for a few of the festivals I covered, I offered prints for sale, at what I thought would be a reasonable cost ($3.75 per 4x6 print). Alternatively, I also offered the full resolution files for a similar cost. While I was not expecting much, I was quite surprised to see that among the three festivals I covered (Alternative in Providence, Yale in spring and Boston in June), only ONE person purchased 3 prints. That's it. I was wondering if anyone cared to comment on that. Is this what you would've guessed? I know I would certainly pay to have some good shots of myself. One reason I can think of is that people could see (and download) a decent size picture from the web for free and apparently that is good enough for most people.
To try to clarify what kind of future a professional "Tango photographer" and/or "Tango/videographer" might have, I have a few questions I would like to ask the community.
1) If a screen resolution picture of you dancing is free to download, would you have any interest in a 4x6 paper print at $3.75? How about in having the full resolution file for $3.75
2) If a screen resolution picture of you dancing is NOT available to download (but rather just a tiny thumbnail size one or a screen size image with watermarking covering most of the surface), would you have any interest in a 4x6 paper print at $3.75? How about in having the full resolution file for $3.75
3) I was thinking about offering (at festivals and/or milongas) a service to record video of the patrons dancing (on demand). It would work like this, the interested party would come see me, pay a fee (per song), and we'd agree on timing. Then I would record them dance with their favorite partner (using a device that allows me to film from a height of 12-15feet, which would allow me to track them at all times). They would then get a DVD at the end of the evening with a high quality recoding. The price I have in mind right now would be $10 per DVD + $10 for each song recorded. So to have a full 3 song tanda recorded, the fee would be $40. If one more DVD (with the same content) is needed, for the other partner, it would be $10 extra. Is this something you would be interested in? Do you find the price: too high, low, about right? An example of a recording I made is here : http://youtube.com/watch?v=tATLum7aDCc . Obviously the quality the youtube video is abysmal compared with the original file which the customer would get.
I would appreciate any thoughts you might have on this issue.
12 comments:
I think offering to videotape people would be likely more lucrative than offering photos. I'm sure everyone wants to know how they look on film for a variety of reasons. there had been photographers at certain milongas I had attended but I felt a bit weird going up to the photographer and asking if he took any photos of me because what if he said no? That would be awkward for both of us. Awkward for me for I would think I wasn't pretty/good/interesting enough to be photographed and awkward for him for being put on the spot. You should let people in the milongas know that you took great photos of them. Show them what it looks like on your camera and offer to give them a copy for a fee. Then give them your business card if they ask for a copy so they can get in touch with you and it would help spread word of mouth. Your business card should have telephone, email and website info with the word Tango really big and eyecatching.
Other thing is that you really need to go heavy on self-advertising. Hand out business cards like mad - each time you give someone your contact info, make sure it's your business card that clearly details exactly what kind of photography/videorecording you do.
And finally, build an online portfolio specializing in just tango - if you're worried about illegal downloading, build a flash-based site that makes that impossible. Here's a link to an excellent example of a beautiful photography site: http://www.soobinsunwoo.com
I think both are good ideas. As long as they do not disturb the milongas. The advice that previous commment entails is really sound. I guess and hope that the filming would be done not during the milonga.
A video of dancing could really help a lot of dancers identifying their weaknesses and help them improve. Like you were pointing out that after you saw the video you decided to focus on your posture, which I think isn't all that bad:)
Finally, I would be interested in buying mostly high resolution digital copies. The paper ones can always be done. The problem is I am yet to find one single picture of me taken during the many festivals I attended. Also, I would not probably ask the photographer to take my pictures, I think this would mess up my dance, make me feel awkward, especially if it was during a milonga. I don't know if this helps at all. These are just my personal preferences. All the best of luck.
I wouldn't pay anything to have someone intrude on my dancing.
Hey, seems most people would rather be photographed in a studio setting than at a milonga where they want to focus on their own dancing and not be self-conscious or distracted by photographers.
Maybe just handing out your card and offering to photograph them outside of the milongas is a wiser idea.
I have been photographed at milongas. Some of the pictures are reasonably well-lit, in focus, and flattering, too. Yet looking at them doesn't do anything for me. So much of what is enjoyable about social tango is internal – how the music tugs at your heart strings, how your partner feels in your arm, how two persons connect. Most if not all of these are not apparent to the outside world, and thus not amenable to being captured on a visual medium. Performers can be photogenic precisely because they know how to project feelings onto to the surface. Most of us in milongas feel much more than we show, so our pictures and videos are likely to feel flat compared to our memory of the experience. If you are discrete, patient, observant, and dedicated to taking hundreds if not thousands of pictures, you might find a few that capture a fleeting emotion of tango. These will be cherished works of art, but I doubt that you will make much of a living from them.
It is hard enough building a career as a free-lance photographer. Why limit yourself to tango photography, a small and not lucrative niche? I appreciate that you are trying to combine two of your great passions. (You can make it three if you go to all the jobs on your motorcycle). Be careful that when you turn your hobbies into work, the work does not ruin the hobbies. I used to be an avid photographer and still indulge in it on occasion. I find that doing well as an event photographer requires dispassionate detachment, concentration on tasks, attention to details, focus on solving problems, in other words, a wholy different mind set than that of a fully immersed and absorbing participant. One can choose to either live life or be a recorder of it. Your choice.
Sorin,
The only way I see this working , given all the caveats already pointed out by many folks, is for you to print out the photos and post them on a board near the exit of the milonga. This is something cruise ships do. They snap photos of folks on the way in, and while at the festivity, then offer those photos for sale to whomever. I have been known to buy an unflattering photo just to get it off the board.
And videos? Hmm....are you going to clear the floor, turn on big lights and set up a ladder for this? I don't think it works in a crowded milonga - we have lots of examples of too dark and fuzzy glimpses of folks as they wend their way around the floor.
Robin Thomas is a professional photographer. I am sure you could get valuable feedback from him.
Ownership of a camera or a video camera and selling a few pictures and DVDs doesn't make one a professional photographer or videographer.
Sorin,
I've been thinking along similar lines for some time now about photography at milongas or workshop events. I found the same as you, that hardly anyone is interested in purchasing photos of themselves dancing. I've noticed that artists exhibiting paintings/prints have a little more success, but not enough make it worthwhile attanding an event just to sell their art. I think that dancers just want to dance and will only tend to spend money on things that will help them in that... lessons, classes, shoes, clothing. You might find a better market for your photography outside the milonga...
David
At the Sitges festival a photographer was taking pictures during the milongas and then showing them in thumbnail format and you could buy a normal size copy if you were interested.
I checked that no picture of me had been made because as an unskilled dancer I look bad and if a picture of me had been made maybe some malicious friends of mine would have bought one to have their fun.
I appreciate all the input. A few clarifications and answers :
* I cringe when I see posed shots. Aside from working with experienced professional models, I would never attempt to stage people shots.
* For the reason above, I cringe when I see "glamor" shots. Having a choice, I will never take such shots.
* I agree, owning a camera or a camcorder doesn't make one a professional photographer/videographer. Unfortunately that doesn't stop a lot of incompetent photographers from earning money as professional photographers.
* As a "candid" photographer, I try to be as inconspicuous as possible.
* I am fully aware of the many other more lucrative opportunities for photographers, the post was mostly to satisfy my curiosity about the lack of interest in photography in the tango world.
Here are my conclusions :
Most tango dancers feel that a person trying to make (very little) money from something related to tango is some sort of sacrilege. In the year and a half since I started tango I heard vicious comments about the people who (try to) make money organizing festivals, milongas, taking pictures or video. Interestingly, selling tango shoes (at over 100% of the cost in BA) seems to be an acceptable occupation. Also, it seems accepted that tango instructors need to make a living. All the other activities apparently need to be done non-profit, preferably free. Oh well, things are what they are.
Chat with François, who has the Paris Tango link on my site. He is a professional photographer, and may be an person of interest to get some perspective on someone who actually does it for a living.
Sorin,
I don't think the market in its current state would support this idea of selling photos to individuals in the ways you've described. You'd have to work long and hard trying to change people's minds.
I'm more familiar with photographers that specialize in whitewater sports (rafting, kayaking, etc). Professional photographers there don’t make money by selling their photos to random kayakers they happen to photograph. Rather, they make money by selling impressive photos to companies that can use them for advertisement. For instance, a perfect picture of a kayaker running a huge waterfall with the brand name of a helmet manufacturer clearly visible on the helmet can be sold to said helmet manufacturer. Other impressive photos can win money if they win certain contests sponsored by some corporation (either related to the sport of whitewater kayaking or some company that likes to maintain an “extreme” image… like Red Bull). Commercial rafting companies are successful at making money by selling photographs of their clients to them. Their clients, of course, are people who almost always know nothing of rafting and kayaking and just got out to do something new and exciting. The only time there’s a real chance that an experienced whitewater kayaker would pay for a photo of himself is if it’s taken on a guided trip in a very special place, like the Grand Canyon, or a river in New Zealand or Patagonia or some other place that is exotic and famous. The chances of this are better if the price of the photo was included in the package deal.
To apply this to tango, I think you’d either have to sell your photos to those who could use it for commercial purposes or be hired as an official photographer for a festival. The drawback in the latter case is that you probably wouldn’t get to dance much at the same events (you might do better as a DJ). If, however, you’re only interested in selling your photos to those you photograph on individual basis, you may need to go to a famous milonga in BA and photograph tourists.
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